excellent.... This will work out fine I am sure.

I love the idea of the raceway! Bring on the ratables!!

Easier there bud!!! I am a 37 year old "delinquent" myslef. Been into racing (street, track, kart) since I was a kid. Do you remember the days of Malibu Raceway in Mt Laurel?? Never had any major problems there. It was a great place to kids and adults to have a blast. As far as the karting industry is concerned this is a huge shot in the arm for Cinnaminson. People and teams spend tens of thousands of dollars every year in this area. Now we have and indoor all year long facility we can use. This is going to be huge for Cinncity and very well shine a national spotlight on us. The talk about this place within the karting community is HUGE!!!!

I hope where the raceway is being located in Cinnaminson will work out for the township and residents. The Speed Raceway in Englewood Co appears to be in an industrial complex (near a local airport). Their website say the facility is 55,000 square feet; is that comparable to this site. It's a great idea just not sure it should be located in such a restricted area.

Thanx Christina,

Google maps doesn't show all of the businesses so it looks more like industrial near the airport. However, MSN addresses do show it's all commercial.

This is a disgrace. It's tough enough for the retirement community to pull out of Sweetwater, Now it will be ten fold for our seniors to pull out onto Rt 130. They pay taxes too. How about something for our older residents to benefit from.This town is going down...down...down.... I think it's time to add my home to the 200+ already on the market or better yet, maybe I should rent to a family with 10 kids so they can enjoy the race track....

Personally, I like the idea of providing activities for our young people (and old) where they can participate (even bowling alley, arcade, movie theater complex would be great). But the location seems constricting especially with Sonic in the parking lot. If the idea was to repurpose existing buildings it would have been great to see it put in the old Triboro Jeep location on Taylor's Lane (or even on Taylor's lane is one of the industrial complexes) where there's more parking and no residential buildings if that was feasible for the business owners and the township.

I think it's funny that the residents that live over there are concerned with traffic from a senior citizen home but not with a go kart track!

What I find funny is this talk about traffic concerns. Wasn’t this shopping center booming a little over a decade ago when Acme first opened? Do you people really think a Sonic and an Entertainment Race Track is going to be worse than that?

I guess it does depend on if Cinnaminson is lucky to get another tenant for that Acme parcel. Maybe it would be worse but I just don’t foresee a significant traffic impact as opposed to when Acme was in its hay days. I am sure all this stuff gets covered during the planning phase so I think people should just relax and let the system work. If there is a projected impact, the developer will be required to make things right and that is a good thing. PS: I can’t imagine a bowling alley working without liquor sales and a movie theater is doubtful with the massive upgrades planned for the Moorestown Mall theaters.

Maybe that's the way to go for Cinnaminson. An entertainment complex instead of trying to get high end retail stores. And in a location conducive to the volume of patrons. As a community center seems to be costly at this time it would give our town and neighboring ones much needed entertainment.

Paula Guarracino,
Do you work for the shopping center or the entertainment company? The reason I ask is because 1/3 (6) of the comments are from you.

Mary Beth is correct. No one complained when that area was booming years ago with traffic. Now that its dead and slowly coming back to life there are complaints about traffic>? Get a life. Sell your home and go live in a retirement home where you play scrabble all day and its nice and quiet. Maybe the complainers will be happy then.. But I doubt it. Chronic complainers are never happy

Oh,a PS to my post........when we moved there several years ago the traffic was as it is now, therefore, your statement about 'traffic' is a misnomer!! At certain times of the day it is no different than when the Acme and any other store was there. By the way, have you noticed all the cars parked by the 'new restaurant'? Wow, it is crowded!!

can't see beyond their noses. Exactly. Cronic complainers are never happy. Think on that

I haven't seen any cronic complainers posting today......just concerned citizens. Frank, it seems to me you are having just as much to say as those you call "cronic comjplainers'....

Thanks for your response, Paula.....quite reasonable and true....

Not sure if everyone has driven by that center on a Friday or Saturday night. There are more cars there for that buffet than there EVER were at the Acme or the old Clover, even on days like the day before Thanksgiving, Christmas, etc.
The combination of the buffet, the Sonic, and the "raceway" in there is VERY concerning traffic-wise. I foresee a lot of traffic issues, getting in and out, parking, clogging traffic on 130, the jughandle, and Riverton Road. Maybe they have included plans to ease traffic congestion in the development.

As far as "chronic complainers" - I think all citizens - not just a "chosen few" have a right to voice their opinions, positive or negative, on something that has the potential to affect our town. I pay taxes in Cinnaminson too, Frank, and that in and of itself entitles me to express my feelings and concerns on Cinnaminson-related issues. If that makes me a "chronic complainer" then so be it. I'd prefer to think of it as active citizenship and responsibility, but hey, that's just me.

Frank, you misinterpret constructive criticism for complaining. Are you saying that, if given a choice of location, you would still want it in the same location? It's the "perfect" location for all concerned (both residents living next door and behind). Those who say it would be better fitted in a more accessible location are not saying they don't want the business. Do you agree with everything all the time or do you offer suggestions for improving an idea or a plan whether it be at work or at home? Not sure why a name tag has to go any resident that offers a different view or an alternative. I thought that was the purpose of this forum; to give views or concerns without be criticized. That's not very positive.

I have to agree with Frank S on this one because it does seem like there is some chronic complaining over constructive criticism going on especially on this site. Hey Anonin and Paula, you guys speak on active citizenship and expressing an alternative point of view so I was curious, outside of blogging, have you guys ever attended or do you guys volunteer on a planning board or anything like that because that's where real concerns are voiced and addressed? No offense to Patch, but this site just like a certain facebook page is not.

The traffic argument is weak at best. The area is zoned for the size of the parking lot - that lot at maximum capacity is what the civil engineer said was needed - that was then approved by the township. Sonic, Buffet, and Go-Cart track are nothing when put up against a full Acme on the Wednesday before Thanksgiving, Vanity Fair having a sale, and Brother's pizza being busy. If anything, traffic will be LESS since most the lot will be taken up by Sonic's layout (which does have parking, but much less efficient then the spots are they are laid out now.

I say bring it on, bring it ALL on, the last thing Rt 130 needs is more dead shopping malls and store fronts.

Caldor anyone?

Frank S. - there is no place for personal attacks here on Patch.
You do not know me, nor do you know whether I am a "happy person" or not. You could have made your point without the personal attacks.
And to answer Mary Beth - yes, I have attended Township meetings. I was at the "marathon meeting" for the potential redevelopment of the Cinnaminson Home. Again, as I said to Frank, personal attacks are not necessary. You really should not make assumptions that people who post on Patch are ill-informed or not active citizens.

I think it is much worse to stay quiet and say nothing until after it is too late. I voice my opinion as a concerned citizen of the community. Is my voice not "worth" as much as your voice, Mary Beth, or yours Frank? I wonder...

Dan - I am not sure if you have driven by the lot on a Friday or Saturday night, but it is ALWAYS like Acme's lot the Wednesday before Thanksgiving at the Buffet during those times.
To say that the traffic argument is "weak" is completely dismissive of that fact, as well as the fact that a fast food restaurant will bring in high volume, high "turnover" traffic that is sure to cause at least some issues. That lot has never had anything like that (a fast food restaurant) so there is nothing in past years to compare it to.
I certainly hope I am wrong, but to me, it looks like - literally - an accident waiting to happen.

Hopefully the businesses and the Township have worked together to develop some sort of traffic easement or pattern that will aid in the ingress and egress of a higher volume of cars to that location.

Frank - clearly your comment was directed at me. You responded to my comment and addressed me, if not by name specifically. As I stated, personal attacks - such as name calling "chronic complainers" or stating that people who have an opinion must have unhappy lives as you did in your posts - have no place here on Patch. Hope you will keep that in mind when posting in the future.

I am still unclear, Mary Beth and Dan, why we are not permitted, according to your "rules", to express our opinions or concerns.

Dan, while I have no formal background or degree in traffic engineering, all it takes is a little common sense and knowledge of the area to foresee the problems that may arise by adding additional businesses/traffic without providing safer means of entering and exiting the complex.

I foresee the traffic coming across 130 from the 7-11 side, merging with the traffic coming off of Manor Road and down Riverton Road, and the increased traffic flow in and out of the Sonic/Buffet/Go-Kart area as being problematic, especially since that area is already tricky to navigate now, let alone with fast-food restaurant traffic to contend with. I certainly hope that I am wrong, and it will flow smoothly with little to no problems/accidents. Only time will tell I suppose.

And Mary Beth, I assure you that like you, I have attended numerous Township meetings, and have persued other avenues other than posting here on Patch. But as previously stated by others, this is one venue to exchange ideas, opinions, and concerns on the issues facing our town. That is all I was attempting to do. I am not sure whether you are trying to intimidate people from posting differing points of view from your own, but that is what it sounds like.

Mary Beth,
I think everyone here knows that the facility would not be approved to be in that location if the studies had not been done and township ordinances were not adhered to or variances were not obtained. The point of others is being missed; I'm sure they know that everything was checked before the owners got the green light. Some of us believe another site on Rt 130 would be better suited for this type of facility especially for those living directly behind or adjacent to the track. I'm sure it was planned that both food establishments would obtain more patrons with an entertainment type business. But some of us who don't even live that close are concerned for the residents. There are a few large unoccupied spaces on Rt130 that may have been better where people can hang out for awhile after karting. Annon is right; Hibachi Grill parking on Sunday afternoon spanned from middle of vanity fair store up to first entrance of Acme. You may not agree with those who have concerns but hopefully you can at least appreciate them. And for those who live, say off New Albany Rd or closer to Moorestown it might be hard for you to understand living close to the 130 corridor. Empathy doesn't mean you agree but at least understand.

And you're right; there's not a snowball's chance in h... that those in authority are reading these comments and taking any suggestions seriously. I'm sure we all know that but, again, this is a forum to discuss ideas and give opinions in whatever direction you choose. Otherwise, if everyone agreed with everything, Patch's forums would be short and pretty boring. I'm sure you'll agree this is alot better than gossiping with neighbors about each other.

Patchers,
Please refrain from using terms like "harassment" and "cyber bullying." Those are serious offenses and not things I am seeing on Patch, especially in this string of comments. Those phrases should not be thrown around, as we take them seriously if they are in fact happening. However, if you feel you are being cyber bullied or comments violate our terms of service, you MUST e-mail me DIRECTLY at christina.paciolla@patch.com.
Thanks so much,
Christina

Frank, with all due respect, name-calling and saying that people who express an opinion different from yours have "sad lives" is hardly "trying to be nice". This is a friendly discussion board for issues facing our town, and as I had stated previously, the personal attacks have no place here.

I guess I just don't understand the argument that there will be too many cars and too much traffic. Don't we want businesses that will attract alot of people and thrive?

It wasn't an argument when this started; just comments on location (not that the business should not exist period). As with the election, you can't post here without someone taking exception to a different viewpoint. And, as some have said, it's not changing a thing. Maybe we all should just say "yes, I agree" and leave it at that. 40 or 50 "yes, I agree". That would eliminate the free/alternative thinking.

At least have some honor and use your full names if you have that strong of a belief in what you're saying. Maybe the "tone" of these comments would be more civil if you have to acknowledge who you really are. It's ok; it's not that difficult to know the real names. Facebook, NJ property tax search gives plenty of info. Start acting like adults; it's a comment forum unless some of us have more power than we think. (I don't think so...) . From now on, I'll comment only to those with real names; talking to others with an arrogant and superior attitude is very easy when you don't have to own the comments. Nice evening everyone. I'm going to see if I can force some more businesses out of Cinnaminson with my powerful words. Oh, I do like the idea of the go karts in case you missed the comment. Never mind.

Sorry, one more question. For those who are insulted or annoyed by the comments about the location. Is it because you truly find the comments offensive or possibly influencing the businesses to reconsider or is it because they are not agreeing with the township committee and the newly re-elected members?

Enough with the election already, we know its over.

Amen

Wow, some great opinions and concerns are addressed here! Where was everybody when this subject was brought before the planning board? Isn't that the appropriate type of venue for these comments. Christina and the Patch certainly did a wonderful job getting the word out about the meeting to discuss and decide this issue! I am ashamed to see Cinnaminson residents making snarky remarks at each other over an issue that has already been decided. How many of you attended the meetings and expressed these concerns to the board?

Benjamin D,
Please see your board. Thank you

Benjamin D,
Please see your board. Thank you

Benjamin D,
Please see your board. Thank you

The old Triboro location? Have you ever tried getting from Rt 130 South to New Albany road? You'd be sitting there for 10 lights waiting to get out. LOL.

The Racetrack is fine where it is going, people are just mad it's not Lord and Taylor LOL.

laugh out loud
11:45 am on Saturday, January 21, 2012
OMG...all the usuals are back at it..!!! LOL Here's a thought let's sit back and watch this play out, it will be over before it starts. :P Will Smith Get spell check I also find this ridiculous, ha ha!!!! : D Benny D just get a clue! Frank S REALLY? Mary Beth.. WOW what a piece of work! Oh and Marie my neighbor what can I say.... BUSTED!!! Here's a thought If you go to the Township Meetings make sure you wear your name tags, "Hello my name is" so we know who everyone is! :D :D (except Marie I know you) ; )
Together we can make a difference! LOL. :))))))